Help with Melvin

daj

Post   » Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:14 am


Under the section on UTI it says urine is taken via a needle. Is this dangerous? Is it a routine procedure? Melvin is leaving urine spots on the fleece that look brown. I've not seen what looks like obvious blood, but something seems to be going on.

daj

Post   » Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:31 am


Something seems to be up with his pooping too. He's making perhaps twice what he normally does. And during the overnight he is making a liquid poop on his bed. His others are normal, there's just an unusual amount. For about 5 days now though, his bed cover has a large brown stain on it in the morning. I don't know what the connection might be with his urine being dark too?

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Sef
Supporter in 2019

Post   » Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:54 am


The vet should be able to free-catch urine for a sample without having to resort to cystocentesis. The sample will be viable enough to look for red blood cells and determine if this is blood in the urine vs. discoloration due to diet or other causes.

Remind me, what pellet brand is he on?

I wouldn't be as concerned about the higher poop output as with the mushy poops. Has anything at all changed with his diet?

daj

Post   » Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:11 pm


We eat KMS Hayloft pellets. And I don't see where their diet is any different. They are accustomed to getting some melon rind in the morning. I was giving watermelon at the time it started, which seems obvious enough a cause, but we haven't had issues with it in the past. One thing I did notice was that he was leaving the green and only eating the flesh.

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Sef
Supporter in 2019

Post   » Mon Nov 18, 2019 3:21 pm


Watermelon is, as the name implies, largely water. Have you cut it out of the diet to see if the soft poos clear up?

daj

Post   » Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:39 am


Not entirely. I will keep it from him today. It's hard because I want them to be getting Vitamin C. This morning I counted the poop each made overnight Henry: 64, Jack 36, Melvin: 132. That's a whole lot of pooping in about 9 hours. Suddenly he has a voracious appetite, and he's covering his pen in poop. This morning it was all normal, except for his bed, there was one spot of diarrhea. It seems to me, there is something going on. Like I said, he's had no problems on this diet previously, and the other two are not having this issue.

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Sef
Supporter in 2019

Post   » Tue Nov 19, 2019 9:50 am


Watermelon is only moderately high in Vitamin C. See:
http://www.guinealynx.info/chart.html

It is, however, very high in sugars, and it's possible that he has a bacterial overgrowth as a result of those sugars (which might not have been problematic at first, but has had a cumulative effect). It's just a hunch, but it might also explain his increased appetite as an upset in digestive flora can impact absorption of nutrients.

I'd switch to better sources of vitamin C, keeping an eye on sugars and calcium. You could also try adding a probiotic such as acidophilus, which comes in a capsule form and can be sprinkled on his lettuce. That will help re-populate the gut with "good" bacteria. However, if the problem persists or worsens, I'd definitely have a fecal float done and have him evaluated by your veterinarian to look for other possible causes.

daj

Post   » Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:29 pm


will do, Thanks!

daj

Post   » Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:36 pm


He peed on the linoleum tonight, so I got a good look at it. It's brownish orange. Now I'm thinking it's not liquid poop on his bed. As I said, he's making tons of normal poop. It seems now, what I thought was diarrhea is actually brownish orange urine. Could blood make urine look like this, or would blood be obviously more reddish?

Also, now I realize I've given him banana lately too, which is a lot of sugar. He might have lost and ounce or too as well. His weight was steady though, the last 2 times I've checked him. I started him on poop soup tonight.

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Sef
Supporter in 2019

Post   » Wed Nov 20, 2019 5:58 am


Blood is red when fresh, but can dry to a dark pink/rust color. If you like, you can post a picture of it and we can take a look, but it sounds like what you're seeing is just a darker urine if it's more orange. It could be dietary; a few foods, including banana (I think), can alter urine color.

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:29 am


If you are giving banana, I would give only a very small amount. Perhaps a single 1/4" slice and eat the rest yourself.

daj

Post   » Sat Dec 21, 2019 9:33 am


I stopped all fruit for a few days and Melvin's urine cleared up quickly. But then his poop became soft and misshapen, and it seemed like his bowel was overactive. Tere would be poop everywhere. He was producing 2-3 times what the other 2 are doing. I tapered down on even the vegetables, but then removed fruit and vegetables entirely. So, for the past few days he's had nothing but hay and pellets and poop soup. I think his gut flora got out of balance. It started with him over eating on a banana once, while I wasn't looking, and then I think the level of vegetables I was giving per day, which was OK in the past, became problematic for him. Last night was the first night he didn't have a poop storm. I think/hope his gut is rebalancing. I am thinking I should not try to reintroduce vegetables for at least a week. Does this sound right. I am thinking very small amounts of fruit would come even later.

bpatters
And got the T-shirt

Post   » Sat Dec 21, 2019 9:48 am


Sounds like a plan to me. And I'd recommend reintroducing the veggies slowly, one at a time with several days in between, and in small amounts.

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Sef
Supporter in 2019

Post   » Sat Dec 21, 2019 9:56 am


Agree. When you say "poop soup" is this poop from another, healthy guinea pig? You can also try a probiotic and see if it helps.

daj

Post   » Sat Dec 21, 2019 6:37 pm


My plan went out the window the second I left the keyboard. I saw that he'd eaten no pellets or very little, and he just went to his bed. I gave him a small piece of orange and later a bit of cucumber. he's still not eating much. When I take him out to give the soup (yes, with some from a healthy mate) he's shivering, and he drops to his belly in my hands. I sit them in my lap facing away from me and cup their paws in my hand. Usually they will stand, propping themselves on my hand. I've never seen him drop down to a lying position.

In the preceding days he's had a ravenous appetite, darting to the cage to gnaw on it when food was being readied. I assumed he was so hungry because he wasn't absorbing nutrients properly due to his intestinal flora being off. He did fine on just pellets and hay for a couple of days, but now he seems to have lost his appetite. I'm doing the poop soup 3x per day, and he takes it just fine. He is eating his hay here and there, but not coming off his bed which is in his house with a hot water bottle. Shall I try to keep him on small amounts of say, lettuce to ensure he's eating? I will see how it goes tonight and tomorrow.

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Sef
Supporter in 2019

Post   » Sat Dec 21, 2019 7:19 pm


Shivering can be a sign of pain. Does he appear to be bloated? Do you have any more Metacam? Something's clearly not right. Is there any way to get in him to see the vet tomorrow? These symptoms are very concerning.

daj

Post   » Sat Dec 21, 2019 8:08 pm


I don't have Metacam, and I haven't seen any sign of bloating. I just offered him some lettuce and he grabbed it eagerly. My vet isn't in on Sundays, but he has an emergency contact number. I will keep a close watch on him for now and see how it goes.

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Sef
Supporter in 2019

Post   » Sat Dec 21, 2019 8:25 pm


Are you weighing him? The behavior doesn't sound normal. If he's not eating well on his own, you will need to hand-feed:
http://www.guinealynx.info/handfeeding.html

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Sat Dec 21, 2019 10:58 pm


Yes, you absolutely MUST hand feed him if he is not eating. Read the link Sef posted.

daj

Post   » Mon Dec 23, 2019 11:20 pm


Good news on Melvin! He came out of his house last night and started eating hay and pellets, drinking and even chutting at Henry. From there he seemed to slowly return to normal. No more dropping to his belly, and his appetite returned. I'm sure his weight is OK, since it wasn't that long that his appetite disappeared. He went from ravenous to not eating or wanting to stand up, but it seems he just took the better part of a day off to rest and let his gut adjust. From the point of eating too much banana a few weeks ago, his flora seems to have gotten out of whack, and he then had trouble with his normal level of vegetables. It made his poop soft and his bowel over active. We were getting up in the morning to over a hundred poops in his pen.

His poops are pretty much normal now. It took me a while to recognize that the issue of too much poop truly was a problem. Cutting out all fruit and vegetables for a while and poop soup 3x a day seems to have done the trick. I think his intestinal flora is getting back to normal. What a relief. I will keep him on limited fruit and vegetables and poop soup for at least a couple weeks now, and maybe smaller amounts of fruit and vegetables for good. That was scary, and I don't want to repeat it with any of them.

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